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How to deal with manipulators

Discussion in 'Dating, Friendships, and Relationships' started by Corvid, Mar 22, 2016.

  1. Corvid

    Corvid Active Member

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    This is an example regarding a woman I know very well in my town, a former friend. Let's call her "Kerry". She was in a relationship with a local male member of the artistic community, say "Gibson". She told many friends, mutual friends from the same social group, and practically anyone that would listen that Gibson had been physically abusive to her during their relationship. It all came to a head when another female member of the artistic community, say "Jade", physically attacked Gibson at a party on behalf of Kerry, or as a result of Kerry's victim narratives that she spread all over town. Jade also has a chequered history with the truth, manipulation, and unchecked aggression towards men including fabricating police reports and false claims of physical aggression. In short, Jade hates men, and didn't need much of an excuse to attack one, Gibson in this instance.

    Gibson handled it rather well. He rang Kerry the next day as he was still on speaking terms with her. He asked her about the rumours of physical abusive in their relationship. He explained he had been attacked by Jade on Kerry's behalf, as a result of the rumours Kerry had been circulating. Kerry then denied that the physical abuse ever took place. She denied ever spreading the rumours. She did this as a liar caught out, there was no motive other than self preservation at that point. Gibson went on social media after talking to Kerry and put up a short, to the point announcement for all the locals to see. He explained he had been accused of being physically abusive in his relationship with Kerry. He said that he had been physically attacked in public at a party by Jade as a result of these accusations. He said he had called Kerry and she had denied that he had ever been physically abusive to her, and denied that she had ever spread the rumours of abuse about him.

    This was GENIUS on Gibsons' part. First of all, Jade, the woman that physically attacked him, looked like a random crazy bitch... because Kerry had denied the abuse and denied spreading the rumours, which suggests that the attack on Gibson had no clear motive. Second, Kerry ended up losing friends and credibility over it, because she most definitely did spread those rumours and then lied about it to avoid direct confrontation with Gibson. So she revealed herself publicly and completely - a disloyal liar and manipulator. Jades' friends were not too impressed with her, and she ended up a little isolated herself as a result.

    Kerry told me personally about this supposed abuse much earlier, and later, after she had been caught out in her lies, maintained that Jade was crazy and had made up the whole thing. Reminds me of what Judge Judy always says: "If you want to be a liar, you better have a good memory".
     
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  2. BurtMeister3000

    BurtMeister3000 Staff Member

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    This actually reminds me of something politicians do or the media to discredit people who pose a threat to them financially/reputably etc. Very true though.
     
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  3. Corvid

    Corvid Active Member

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    Here's a second titbit from the same person above, "Kerry". Recently, I suffered a chronic illness which was pretty bad for a number of years. Thankfully, I am in much better health now, but looked rather deathly and was rather limited for a long time. My hair thinned out and I decided to shave it all off.

    Kerry had full details of my actual illness as she was a friend at the time. I found out yesterday that while I was ill, Kerry told all her friends that I had cancer and I was dying, which was completely untrue. I suppose she told people that to create drama, maybe to gain sympathy by portraying herself as the grieving friend losing someone close to her.
    I was told that many people were worried about me, but didn't want to raise the subject with me personally because they thought I was terminally ill...:noid:

    I'd also like to point out that Kerry never visited me once during the 3 years I was ill. Worse than that, she continuosly set dates and times to meet, or call over, and never showed up, not once. I had limited energy due to my condition, and she cost me valuable time which I needed to keep other areas of my life going. Once, I asked her to come on a half hour drive to the hospital with me for an appointment, as it was hospital policy to not allow a patient to be discharged to drive alone after that particular test due to risk of passing out behind the wheel. She maintained that she would gladly accompany me to the hospital right up to within an hour or two of the appointment, then made an excuse about a TV man calling to the house to set up her digibox. This left me having to find someone else to accompany me with only a couple of hours to spare. Cancelling the appointment at such short notice carried a penalty of discharge from the outpatient clinic of the hospital, or an additional 6 weeks or more wait for another appointment. I'm sharing those last 2 parts so people can gauge her actual level of concern for my well being, as opposed to how she was portraying herself to me and other people.

    I rang her at one of the times she had said she would call over to visit. She was up town with other friends drinking coffee, and had no problem saying that directly. When I confronted her about her pattern of wasting my time, she hit me with shaming language and I hung up. I suppose she wanted to show me how unimportant she considered me to be, by example, of course, without directly saying it. This goes into another area which has been covered by Sandman and Trevor Freeman: Many women do not give a fuck about men when they're sick because they have no utility value to them. Another topic, another time.
     
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  4. BurtMeister3000

    BurtMeister3000 Staff Member

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    That was a good move by Gibson, but had he gone on social media and Kerry had denied denying spreading the rumours or laid it on thick and said something like oh I dunno.."Oh, I only said that because I was scared he would hit me again" it might not have worked. Recording conversations is the best weapon in these instances, cameras don't lie and they have a way of making people be on their best behaviour.
     
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  5. BurtMeister3000

    BurtMeister3000 Staff Member

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    Fuck! What a horrible bitch!!!

    She sounds like she is narcissistic. The whole thing with the shaming language after you call her on being a shitty friend, makes me think she has the attitude that she was doing you a favour by being friends with you.
     
  6. Corvid

    Corvid Active Member

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    Yep Burty, Gibsons' move carried that risk, but he had something that helped him alot: social status and credibility. Women are highly conscious of social status, and will risk more if the individual they are gossiping about is lower on the totem pole than them. Could be why their manipulations and gossip often contain components intended to lower their targets' social status and credibility. It appears that Kerry either didn't think of your suggested move (as she's more on the compulsive liar and manipulator side rather than the calculated type), or she flinched when caught and hesitated with her counter move, or she simply backed down because of Gibsons' status and credibility.
     
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  7. BurtMeister3000

    BurtMeister3000 Staff Member

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    Sounds like that could be the case or maybe she felt her powers of bullshitting weren't up to the task and may have to go on spinning more and more tales, so honesty is the easier, less effort filled choice in the end.
     
  8. Corvid

    Corvid Active Member

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    Got it in one, total narcissist.
    Knowing her as I do, I think that if Gibson hadn't put up that message for everyone to see at the same time and had instead told friends on an individual person to person basis, Kerry would have denied in private to friends that the phone conversation between her and Gibson ever took place. Or she would have altered the facts of the conversation later. Gossip and manipulation on the smaller, local scale is subversive. It's private messages on FB, long chats on the phone with intimates, snatches of conversation over coffee with confidants sworn to secrecy. The thing these individuals fear most is being exposed, so they're usually careful. Even the compulsive types can operate for years without being properly recognised by the entire community.

    All that said, I've witnessed it being done locally a few times in front of an audience of 12-15 people with great success on behalf of the manipulators. The "stage performances" were blended with the usual subversive bullshit as well. That's part of a longer, more complicated example for another time.
     
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  9. Corvid

    Corvid Active Member

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    I want to add a little on the subject of friends and illness as it came up here. I have few regrets or grievances in the long run. There's something to be learned from every experience, you just have to pay attention and know where to look. Fantastic, lifelong friends revealed themselves when I was ill. That experience was a crucible, bonds were forged there that can't be broken, where others that may have appeared strong on the surface fell away and disintegrated. People revealed their true selves when I was in dire need, and when I could offer little or nothing in return. It was a powerful experience to go through, there's debts I can never repay. There's aspects of myself I left behind too, mostly parts I no longer needed. That experience showed me who my lifelong friends are, and I'm not ashamed to admit that when I think about what those people did for me in a situation where they had no gain for themselves, I get a bit emotional. I'm grateful to be alive, healthy, and to know who those people are. Let those other people fall away, and find their own way. I'd rather let them go than waste time and energy on them, where it can do no good.
     
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  10. Corvid

    Corvid Active Member

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